Pre-1921 Cleveland info wanted

Marc, assuming it's a mens frame, is the top tube straight or does it bend?

I'm not aware of any pattern with the pre 1920s numbers. The Cleveland 455 you traded to me is c.1918 and has # 028; my c.1918 Cleveland 458 is # 101294; and my Cleveland 404, which has a lower badge number than my 458, has a higher serial number: 261907.
And yours is a 5 digit number. If anyone here can link pre 1920 serial numbers to years, I'd love to know about it.

The colour looks like a deep maroon, not really purple.

Can you post a photo of the entire frame, and/or the drop outs and seat clamp?

Here is the fulll frame. drop outs are like my 1924. top tube is straight. Thanks for your help Brian.

M. 

If you can't post photos because the file is too large, you can crop the edges off until it's below 2MB. They will upload to this site after that.

I think I was successful. Let's try again Brian.

Hello Marc,

With regards to the paint, CCM never offered a purple colour like this. The undercoat looks grey and yhe CCM undercoats that I have seen are like a brownish-red rust colour. It may just be a previous owner's attempt to match a heavily faded CCM maroon colour, and not original.

The vast majority of early bikes were painted black. "Red Bird" was a notable exception, with a reddish maroon colour from before the turn of the century. In 1919, CCM was offering the following colours, at extra cost, in addition to the standard black on their higher priced bicycles;

No.1 - Black with Green and Gold Stripe

No.2 - Black with Red Head

No.3 - Maroon

No.4 - Maroon with Gold Stripe

No.5 - French Grey with Red and Gold Stripe

No.7 - French Grey with Red Sunburst Head, Red and Gold Stripe

No.9 - Green with Gold Stripe

No.10 - Grenn with Gold Sunburst Head and Gold Stripe

Numbers 6 and 8 were not listed. This information was taken from a 1919 Massey catalogue.

I hope this helps.

John Williamson

Thanks for the info John, much appreciated. It's unfortunate that it was repainted, if that is the case, which I think it is.

Good day toall,

A while back I posted this message with color questions. aia now have a Bottom Bracket question regarding the same frame. The size of the cup is:

45mm shell opening, and 73mm long. I am not able to figure out what type of crankset I need. 

The standard CCM cranksets are too big for this one. 

The frame is pre-1921, which makes me beleive the crank set might be British.

Any help would be appreciated. 

Marc from Ottawa. 

Hello Marc send me you contact info  too   gtflyte@hotmail.ca I can help you out with some parts and tell you what you need 

My model Cleveland is a #416 and has the same hanger crank assembly I have spare cups available and some other parts Greg

Greg, I sent you an e-mail. Thanks

I recently acquired what I believe is a pre 1921 Cleveland men’s hygienic cushion frame. It’s missing the model number plate on the badge so that makes it hard to date. The crank appears to be from a 1930s Ccm, pedals are the zinc ones which I know are not correct. The bottom bracket isn’t the open one with the 2 bolts, but it has a BUMP underneath instead. Overall Bike is a good rider, as it has steel Dunlop W.O rims laced with newerish hubs. I’d like to learn more about these bikes as I have grown fond of these era ccms. Brian and Greg have been helpful with providing me with some knowledge and I appreciate anything else I can learn. I was told that Dave brown might have supplied some parts on this bike serval years ago but the seller couldn’t not remember. 

Hi simonkarl

 i did have a few of the Hygienic cushion bikes at one time and might have supplied parts  but can't remember either. i did have springs made some time ago, about 20 of them I have one left. Still have my CCM Massey Silver Ribbon hygienic frame  Toronto made bike that i have had a long time. Mine has the early Massey Harris crank on it.

I recently acquired what I believe is a pre 1921 Cleveland men’s hygienic cushion frame. It’s missing the model number plate on the badge so that makes it hard to date. The crank appears to be from a 1930s Ccm, pedals are the zinc ones which I know are not correct. The bottom bracket isn’t the open one with the 2 bolts, but it has a BUMP underneath instead. Overall Bike is a good rider, as it has steel Dunlop W.O rims laced with newerish hubs. I’d like to learn more about these bikes as I have grown fond of these era ccms. Brian and Greg have been helpful with providing me with some knowledge and I appreciate anything else I can learn. I was told that Dave brown might have supplied some parts on this bike serval years ago but the seller couldn’t not remember. 

This Bike is a tall frame 24”, the spring is larger then the ones you had made Dave. I’d love to find out what crank came on it originally and the year if possible. 

Hi Simon

I would think it had the type of crank Greg is showing.

That’s what I thought Dave 

If anyone has a spare crank assembly kicking around, I’d be more then happy to purchase it, if it was for sale.

Hi Simon, from what I have read, if your BB has a bump then it had a single piece crank. The bump is supposed to facilitate installation and removal because the BB diameter is too small. 

I may be incorrect, but the literature seems to indicate that your frame would predate the model T Crank shown in the above photos. 

Yes after further investigation I concurred the 1 piece crank. I recently purchased the correct kidney shaped chain ring so now it’s looking better. Still on the hunt for a proper nickel plated stem bolt if anyone has one kicking around I’d be willing to grab it. I can bring the bike to the winter swap to have some more expertise members check it.